This is a followup to this post. Some solutions were discussed in the comments, and I want to address them here.
All of this assumes we don't change the central rules of the campaign:
- time passes in the game as it does in the real world when we're between sessions, and "catches up" if we have to split a session within the dungeon.
- XP is per delve, not per session.
- PCs don't participate unless the player participates, unless the game ended in the dungeon at the previous session. Those are ended ASAP so the missing player's PC can be returned to town.
So now what?
Warping in/out of PCs
Just warp in characters from players who return to the game, and warp out characters of those players who can't make it. Simple!
I want a credible, in-game-logical solution for the problem. The forces of chaos warping out one PC and warping in two is not that. The PCs would want to investigate. We'd want an explanation of why they gathered rumors, girded on their weapons, and otherwise got ready for a delve. They'll want to know if the guys warping out can leave some of their stuff behind - and if not, is it critical to pass important gear to a PC of a player who definitely will be there (or put it on the floor of a Sactuary, or drop it in combat, or whatever)?
That solution is also rife with abuse if it can happen in combat. Your PC is heavily wounded? Fine, warp him back to town and safety by not showing up next session. You could rescue a whole party from a TPK by having everyone who can't easily escape from the fight just not play that session. It might suck to do, but you saved your 400 point guy from death!
This might seem like reductio ab absurdem, and it might be, but it's not just done for argumenative purposes. These are things that is possible a group - including my group - might do.
Plus, we have the issue of giving XP per delve, not per session. So if someone is warped in and another warped out, then what? Who gets what XP? We solve one problem and create a new one.
Safe Space in the Dungeon
I could have a group of NPCs create a safe space in town.
The big problem I see with this is that it is not town.
If all it provides is a safe, monster-free space to rest in the dungeon, that's the same as using the Sanctuary spell. That's fine, but it doesn't allow for swapping of characters.
If it is town, and people can come and go, then all I did was move "town" down a few levels in the dungeon. The PCs have every reason to base out of that from then on - why not? If you can get everything you could in Stericksburg, then it's basically Stericksburg except in name.
I'd need to do some real explaining about the group that created this base, and what they can provide.
My players are likely to want to choose the best of both worlds - yeah, I stay in the dungeon in the "safe area," but I go back to town real quick in the four weeks between game and learn some spells, get some rumors from there ("Unless my guy knows there are better ones in the dungeon safe area"), and so on. I could say if you leave, you leave, but that makes no in-game sense.
Gates are a potentially good solution. The PCs would need one that leads to a safe base they can easily return from.
The problem is still, as always, getting PCs in and out. If PCs can be swappped, then, logically, PCs have access to the gate without going through the dungeon. Therefore there isn't a need to go into and out of the dungeon. Plus, the PCs will want to take advantage of the special traits of that gate area - special gear, trade opportunities (some of players will say they don't want to play DF Far Trader, but they'll do this), special skills to learn, rumors from a new place, potential adventure avenues. All of this makes perfect sense. I wouldn't shut all of that down just to provide a "safe base" or a town substitute without needing to create a seperate area from Stericksburg that otherwise acts as one.
Just speed up getting to the dangerous areas
This we do already. It's helpful. It still takes some time, but much less than you might suspect. The PCs have done a good job steamrolling everything that might bother them on the way down. I often handwave returns to town once the PCs get to the GFS, since it's rare anything is really an issue. Even so, it's not uncommon for the players to take a good 30-45 minutes to really get down to gaming. Then you get rumors, spending points even though that's supposed to be done by email between sessions, changing plans based on rumors, etc. We break for lunch at 2 pm, so, in theory, almost half of the session is before break (11-2 = 3 hours) and the rest (3-7 = 4 hours) is after. It's extremely common for the PCs to just really be getting going by 2 pm . . . just reaching the first area to be investigated, just reaching the bottom of the stairs, etc.
So I think we have a big potential gain here, if the players will decide what to do, definitively, before the session starts.
And then there is combat time - that's a whole other post about simplifying combat. I'll see if I can get that up later in the week!
Also, related:
How Adventurers Become Dungeon Dwellers
Have a one-way teleportation circle in town. It should not be free or 100% reliable (failure gets you to the level with a possible random encounter; critical failure makes the random encounter more likely and has HP loss). You can teleport to a level or a person you know (i.e., a fellow party member). Deeper is less reliable and more expensive; to a person is more reliable.
ReplyDeleteOr something like that. The idea is teleportation can happen only from a circle, and circle-to-circle is more reliable. It’s not free.
Skipping teleportation and going through the dungeon ensures a random encounter of the level you’re trying to reach. You can try to flee (use the value for chases from Action: DX+Speed/Range-based Move), but even if you do, there’s a pretty good chance that just means the random encounter happens when you reach the whole party. Hope they’re not already in combat.
Let me rename your answer: create a new entrance to the dungeon that leads to a deeper level. This can be done magically from town or just by Peter architecting a new secret tunnel (which the players have to locate).
DeleteI don't know how teleports in DF work but in the AD&D sense this could be a wizard who has intimate knowledge of ONE location and can set the characters there safely. The fun part is when the monsters start realizing the PCs sometimes appear deep in the dungeon and lay traps and ambushes for arriving characters. This can lead to a whole hijacked adventure where the players have a plan but when they show up they are immediately attacked and the adventure turns from "delve deeper" to "we have to fight out way out of the dungeon the long way!" Still it sounds like Peter's group would want explanations and want to gain their own intimate knowledge of areas and special teleport spells so they can not be reliant on an NPC, which could then bog down his game into non-adventuring quests to obtain measurements of an empty room instead of exploration and treasure gathering. Side note: instead of lost HP and random encounters on mishaps I'd have the target drift...maybe the party appears in the wrong room (that may still be occupied or hazardous) or on a crit fail they are actually off by a couple levels (that could mean wasting time finding their location and getting to the right level or dropping them into an area too dangerous for the characters gathered for the session).
The mundane method only requires that the entry and exit points be areas the players haven't thoroughly examined for secrets yet. The down side is that they have no reason to suspect this or search for it until they see or hear something that tips them off. Unless Peter basically hands them this for free it could go completely undiscovered for years, which doesn't help the game at all.
Thank you for your answer!
ReplyDelete"If it is town, and people can come and go, then all I did was move "town" down a few levels in the dungeon. The PCs have every reason to base out of that from then on - why not?"
Yes, it is exactly the point of my suggestion. Is there any problem with that? You just save some time to go to the dungeon and to retreat from there.
"If you can get everything you could in Stericksburg, then it's basically Stericksburg except in name."
Of course, you could add some diferences between this base and Stericksburg (for example: less rumors - and different ones, higher CoL, no special order items and so on), but I do not think it is nessesary.
Actually, what is the distance between Stericksburg and the lowest "save" level of Felltower? If I understand correctly, about a day walking? So PCs can easily walk to Stericksburg and back any time they want or need between games (to live there, if it is cheeper, to buy something, study and so on). But you could start actual games in this base and ban all "in-town" activity at the game table (but permit it throu e-mailing between games) to speed up playing.
"I'd need to do some real explaining about the group that created this base, and what they can provide."
For example, the Church of the Good God decided to build large cathedral temple in Stericksburg (they probably are rich enough for that becouse of money, that PCs spend on resurrections, healing and so on). This building project requires a lot of hewn stone, and Felltower is the nearest sourse of it. So the Church hired a team of stonemasons (probably Dwarves) to mine stone at the upper levels of Felltower. There probably also will be some soldiers to protect them, some healers and priests and some servants, cooks, traders and so on. It will be, actually, a part of Sterickburg, thet moved into the dungeon. And all this mining could wake up a dragon...
I get all that . . . but I could get the same exact thing by saying, "Okay, you head to Felltower and can make it to any of these map points in total safety" and then indicate those points. I could allow the PCs to make it back from them in equal, total safety. It takes far, far less explanation other than, "Guys, for game speed reasons, let's say nothing bad happens on the way to this part of the dungeon."
DeleteYes, of course, you can do that. But in my opinion in-game explanation works better ("-but why there are now no random encounters in this area?" "-becouse they were all driven out by dwarvish miners and soldiers") and also is more interesting (new rumors, new NPCs to talk with and so on).
DeleteAdditionaly, you get "Guys, for game speed reasons, no more in-town activity during actual play" from the same in-game explanation.
It's a high cost in effort and explanation - and additional effects in game - versus saying, "Your care and caution means you have no encounters on the largely empty upper layers."
Delete"Guys, for game speed reasons, no more in-town activity during actual play"
I don't think that would work. It is asking the PCs to give up a lot - shopping, rumors, etc. - in return for a dubious gain. It's easier to handle that in a meta-way, and just say you need to spend XP and do any shopping before the session starts.