Basic Set: Characters p. 287 gives some extraordinarily high DR and HP for shields. The numbers are identical to 3e's one-shot breakage number (which becomes DR here) and overall HP.
Low-Tech has new, different shields with standardized DR (2 for flimsy ones, 4 otherwise) and HP based on their weight.
What if we apply the rules for Damage to Objects to Basic Set-weight shields?
Light Shield 2 lbs. = 10 HP. 60 HP to get to -5xHP. Overpenetration DR = 7 (4 + 10/4)
Small Shield 8 lbs. = 16 HP. 96 HP to get to -5xHP. Overpenetration DR = 8 (4 + 16/4)
Medium Shield 15 lbs. = 18 HP*. 108 HP to get to -5xHP. Overpenetration DR = 9 (4 + 18/4)
Large Shield 25 lbs. = 20 HP**, 120 HP to get to -5xHP. Overpenetration DR = 9 (4 + 20/4)
* 19 HP, and 114, if you calculate it by hand as Cube Root of 15, x 8, rounded.
** 23 HP, and 138 HP if you calculate it by hand as Cube Root of 25, x 8, rounded.
Metal versions, per Low-Tech, would just be lighter for the same DR 4 and HP. I'm not sure why the same DR; it should be 6 like any other all-metal weapon.
Now, these are actually much more fragile if you use the rules from DFRPG. Exploits, p. 55 has object broken automatically at -1xHP. So they'd actually break on 20, 32, 36 (or 38), and 40 (or 46) points of damage, and cease to function as shields at 0 HP, which means just 10, 16, 18 (or 19), and 20 (or 23) damage past their DR 4.
If I used those numbers vs. my proposed Felltower shield rules:
- Light Shields are 20 HP and 40 HP to destroy automatically.
- Small Shields are 30 HP and 60 HP to destroy automatically.
- Medium Shields are 40 HP and 80 HP to destroy automatically.
- Large Shields are 60 HP and 120 HP to destroy automatically.
So the smaller shields have less maximal potential HP but are threatened with destruction earlier in the system above. The larger shields are proportionally not much worse off in the system below - and the large shield is much stronger in the system below. The system at the top makes for weaker metal shields, though, as they gain a lot of weight (2x weight using DF modifiers, generally) but HP don't double; cube roots are tough on large items.
To really fit DFRPG rules, they should be non-functional as shields after 20, 30, 40, and 60 HP. Assuming DR 4 and a single blow.
Light Shield: 18 cutting damage (18 - 4 = 14, x 150% vs. Homogenous) or 24 crushing.
Small Shield: 24 cutting damage or 34 crushing.
Medium Shield: 31 cutting or 44 crushing.
Large Shield: 44 cutting or 64 crushing.
An option at 0 HP is a confirmation roll, like under Broken Weapons, p. 56. 1-3, your shield is broken off the handles and useless. On a 4-6, it's hanging on; you get DB from it but can no longer use it to Block. For a buckler, 1-3 the shield is broken off the handle and useless, 4-6 the shield is broken in half; DB drops to 1 DB (0 for a Light shield).
So it seems like an either/or. The second system is non-canonical but has less rolling. The one at the top has a lot more rolling but has the benefit of working exactly like any other object breaking in GURPS.
I'm still deciding what to do, here. Probably the sturdier shields with the automatic breakage at 0 HP, with a confirmation roll.
I'd likely go with automatic breakage at -1xHP as per DFRPG, but no rolling and continued operation at 0 and less HP. That way I don't have to adjust any numbers, divergence from related rules is minimal and shields are decently sturdy. If I find shields like that too flimsy, I could always tweak it further by saying they break at further negative multiples of HP.
ReplyDeleteThanks for bringing this to my attention; I don't normally use damage to shields but I'm planning a Darkest Dungeon inspired campaign and it definitively has a place there.
That sounds like a good approach. I'm glad these posts have been helpful.
DeleteNote that since a shield is an object, it will be at half effectiveness (DB, since that's the only thing it does other than shield bashes) once it drops below HP/3. Since we round down, a light or small shield would give DB 0 (basically, grants a Block defense but adds nothing), and a medium or large shield would give DB 1. Since the shield is so pathetic at 0 HP anyways, just having it splinter at this point wouldn't affect much.
ReplyDeleteNot per DFRPG, though, if you use those rules - there is no effect until 0 HP.
DeleteEven in Basic Set, though, halving is explicitly optional.
It's worth noting that DFRPG doesn't have a HP/3 threshold under Damage to Objects, if one is using only that and not also GURPS Basic Set.
DeleteNinja'd by Peter :)
DeleteWe're talking house rules, not DFRPG or GURPS, so I fail to see how not having the HP/3 threshold for objects in DFRPG is especially relevant. I'm merely pointing all this out for guidance from similar rules that the shield would be likely be ineffective at 0 HP anyways.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure how it's not, given that I'm discussing the above in light of using the DFRPG rules.
Delete